Surge protectors and UPS systems

TidBITS Talk
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Well, there is no doubt that they do more marketing than any other manufacturer of similar hardware. I’m not able to determine, given my technical knowledge, if this has affected their reliability and longevity though.

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I have had solar panels installed on buildings in Florida and California. In both cases I have talked extensively with the installers, and observed the long term benefits. One of the greatest benefits is the requirement to retrofit the building to improve its thermal envelope, including better sealing and less thermally transparent windows and doors, as well as much better insulation all round.

In Florida, I imagined the wind in a hurricane could get under the solar panels and lift the panels off, perhaps taking part of the roof too. The installer told me the fact is the opposite, solar panels protect the roof. The steel frame of the panels reinforces and strengthens the roof. Wind driven debris danger to the panels is less than to shingles, because the panels are stronger. Several hurricanes since installation have cause no damage to the panels.

A design question for insulation of solar panels on my house near Los Angeles was where on the roof should they go. The obvious answer, “the part that gets the most intense sun,” could be determined without the available fancy software tools. Asphalt shingles on the roof elements facing south and west were badly decayed and in need of replacement; roof elements facing other directions were still in good condition. A roofer explained that the major cause of aging of shingles is oxidation of the asphalt due to sunlight. We replaced the damaged roof parts, then installed the solar panels over the restored roof. The expectation is that the parts of the roof now protected from direct sunlight by the solar panels will last much longer than parts exposed to the sun.

Temperature fluctuation between night and day as great as 50 degrees F, due to the dry climate near Los Angeles, let us not install AC. Instead we used passive temperature control, opening the windows in the evening, then closing up early in the morning. This led me to actively observe how the house temperature varied, so I could optimize our “passive” system. The closed attic space became an unbearably hot oven in summer. After installation of solar panels the heat was much less extreme. My explanation is shade from the panels greatly reduces the temperature of the roof part most exposed to sun. While a benefit for summer cooling, I expect the contribution of shade to winter heating would be the opposite.

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63

I’m curious why you want a UPS with true sine output for the OLED TV specifically. Almost every piece of consumer electronics (and most professional) these days uses switch-mode power supplies on the AC input and I don’t think they would care about stepped vs. true sine.

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Simulated sine waves include all kinds of high frequency noise components, which need to be filtered out by the capacitors in your power supply.

In theory, it shouldn’t matter. But I’m concerned that:

  • Not all power supplies are well designed

  • As a device gets older, its capacitors won’t work as well.

  • I’ve been told (no proof) that those high frequency components can reduce the life of those capacitors over time. Maybe not a concern if you’re going to replace the device in 5-10 years, but could be a real problem if you want to keep electronics for a long time.

    But maybe that’s only applicable to linear power supplies, which were what almost everything used in the 80’s, when I read this.

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Thanks for this perspective, Ron. It really does take some technical chops, and willingness to seek answers, to get the best results from a lot of technology.

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Last night we had a system of strong thunderstorms roll through and we executed our normal process when lightning is imminent - going through the house and turning off all our surge protector strips (we don’t have any power strips without surge protection) which power electronics that won’t be needed during the storm such as printers, TVs we won’t be using, stereos we won’t be using, etc.

Then it occurred to me that this TidBITS Talk discussion that I’ve been following hasn’t mentioned this benefit of surge protectors. If a device isn’t drawing power (or standby power) it’s less likely to feel a power surge. Being able to turn off multiple devices with one switch is very handy. Since a power surge in a thunderstorm destroyed our TV years ago, it’s been a standard part of our lightning storm preparations.

Of course, our surge protectors wouldn’t protect our electronics from a direct lightning strike, but they might help (maybe/hopefully) even if they go up in a puff of smoke.

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Exactly, I tend to think that switch-mode supplies don’t (or shouldn’t) care because the part that “sees” the AC input is different than in a linear supply. But now that I think about it, in a linear supply the first component is a big transformer, which acts as a low-pass filter and would reduce some of the HF noise you mention. After that is a rectifier, then you’ve got messy DC, and filter caps to smooth it out. So I’m not sure if a stepped AC input matters or not. I might ask around because my knowledge of power supply design is not deep enough!

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You’re talking about a power strip with an on/off switch, whether it includes surge protection or not. The switch typically disconnects all devices from the line side of the incoming power (not sure if any also open the neutral). So, yes, that’s great protection for those devices–unless a nearby lightning strike causes an arc across the power switch, which is unlikely. The only thing better is unplugging completely.

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69

The benefit of the switch on the strip is that is physically disconnects the hot line (probably not the neutral, however). This will definitely prevent some surges from getting to your devices, even if they get through the strip’s MOVs.

Note that this is different from just turning off your device, because most products don’t fully disconnect when you turn them off. They usually either go into standby, or they disconnect the output of the power supply. Which means the power supply can still be damaged by a surge, even when the device is powered off.

“Direct” is relative here. If lightning strikes the line feeding directly into your home, all bets are off. Unless you’ve got a lightning arrester installed between your home and where lightning struck, your home is going to see tens of thousands of volts. That will blow just about everything connected, and will likely arc across switches and even the contacts in receptacles. The EMP from such a “direct” strike this nearby can also cause damage to equipment that’s not even connected. It can also start fires.

But if lightning strikes “nearby” (again, this is a relative term), equipment installed by the utility company should limit the voltage reaching your home to about 3000v. This can cause a lot of damage to connected equipment, but shouldn’t start any fires. A good surge suppressor may or may not be able to protect against this - I wouldn’t count on it unless the product explicitly states that it can.

FWIW, the ZeroSurge devices I use on my A/V equipment claim that they can redirect multiple 3000v surges to ground (and away from your equipment) without blowing out. I don’t think anything using MOVs can make this claim. I’ve seen demonstrations that seem to validate this claim, although I have, fortunately, no first-hand experience.

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@Shamino Thanks for the detailed information about the different types of surge protectors. I recently paid an electrician to install a Type-2 SPD (CHSPT2ULTRA), which I thought would protect all my devices from electrical surges from outside my home. Apparently that was mistaken and the CHSPT2ULTRA doesn’t provide any protection from lightning strikes or other surges originating outside my home? … I guess I should look into a Type-1 SPD, though Eaton’s equivalent (CHSPT1ULTRA) appears to cost well over $1k before installation!

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I’m going to have to defer to others at this point. What I know is what I’ve read about the various UL classes, and I’ve already written what I know.

Eaton’s web site says the CHSPT2ULTRA provides whole-home protection, but it is installed as a type-2 device (on the load side of your main breaker). But I don’t know enough about its design to be able to answer your question. Nor do I know if a type-1 SPD will be worth the cost.

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Thank you! That’s good information for me to consider!
One corollary to your last point on the temperature fluctuations - my parents had a whole house fan installed in the attic, and I was surprised at how well it could keep the interior of the house livable by significantly increasing the air flow into the ground floor windows (regardless of whether there was a breeze) and drawing it through the house and exhausting the warmer air out through the attic. They were in Illinois, but I’m considering that for my retirement home as well.

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I used Perplexity to ask about the relationship between a true sine wave UPS and an OLED TV, exported the answer to markdown, and pasted it below. I’m trying out using Perplexity after reading the article @ace posted about answer engines, and I think that the ability to export the answer to one (or more) of markdown, pdf, or docx will be very useful to me. It’s another use case that I hadn’t really considered when using an answer engine / AI search (I don’t recall seeing it as an easily accessed option in other tools).

I want to say that I had originally seen the requirement for a true sine wave in the Sony documentation, but it’s been a couple of years and I honestly don’t remember where I saw it - only that it was stressed as a requirement if you choose to use a UPS.

Why use a true sine wave UPS for an OLED TV

Using a true sine wave UPS for an OLED TV ensures optimal performance and longevity due to its clean, grid-like power output. Here’s why it matters:

Compatibility and Safety

A true sine wave replicates utility power’s smooth oscillation[1][2], which is critical for sensitive electronics like OLED TVs. Modified sine wave UPS systems produce stepped approximations that can introduce electrical noise or voltage irregularities[1:1][3], potentially stressing components over time.

Reduced Risk of Damage

OLED TVs rely on precise voltage regulation for their delicate organic diodes and power supplies. True sine wave UPS systems minimize heat buildup and electrical noise[1:2], lowering the risk of long-term component degradation compared to modified sine wave alternatives[4].

Stable Performance

During power outages or fluctuations, a true sine wave UPS maintains a steady voltage (e.g., 118–121V)[4:1], preventing abrupt shutdowns that could interrupt critical processes like automatic pixel refreshes[5]. Modified sine waves may cause voltage “steps” that disrupt sensitive circuitry[3:1][2:1].

Long-Term Cost Efficiency

While more expensive upfront, true sine wave UPS systems reduce maintenance costs by extending battery life and protecting against damage from unstable power[1:3][4:2]. For high-end OLED TVs, this investment safeguards against costly repairs or premature failure[5:1].

Key Considerations

  • Voltage Regulation: High-end true sine wave UPS units maintain tighter voltage tolerances (e.g., ±2V) compared to budget models[4:3].
  • Runtime: Ensure the UPS has sufficient capacity to support the TV’s power draw during outages[6][7].

In summary, a true sine wave UPS provides the cleanest, safest power for OLED TVs, mirroring grid electricity to ensure reliability and protect sensitive components[1:4][2:2][4:4].

⁂

  1. The Importance Of Pure Sine Wave UPS Systems ↩︎ ↩︎ ↩︎ ↩︎ ↩︎

  2. https://minutemanups.com/sinewave-vs-simulated-sinewave/ ↩︎ ↩︎ ↩︎

  3. https://superuser.com/questions/912679/when-do-i-need-a-pure-sine-wave-ups ↩︎ ↩︎

  4. https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=378957 ↩︎ ↩︎ ↩︎ ↩︎ ↩︎

  5. Value UPS / Stabiliser for OLED TV - Please Help Out | HiFiVision.com ↩︎ ↩︎

  6. https://www.reddit.com/r/LGOLED/comments/1b43pay/ups_andor_surge_protector_for_new_oled/ ↩︎

  7. Making sure you're not a bot! ↩︎

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