Apple TV 4K as streaming box

TidBITS Talk
1

I have a Sony Android TV. There’s so many apps. I use Netflix, Plex, HBO Max, YouTube, plus I have the apps for Paramount+ and Starz installed. But there’s a problem.

Watching TV from the HDMI attached cable box, my HDMI attached Blue-Ray Disc player, Netflix, or Plex (when streaming 5 channel audio) outputs Dolby Digital discrete 5.1 channel audio through the optical cable to my AVR, which doesn’t support HDMI ARC. But, the HBO Max, Paramount+, and Starz apps do not do DD. The best I can get there is matrixed Dolby Pro Logic. This is aggravating.

I can live with it, because the reason I have HBO Max, Paramount+, and Starz is because I’m paying for those channels through my cable system. I get the streaming app access “for free”. The only streaming app I’m paying for separately is Netflix, and as I said, it does produce glorious Dolby Digital sound.

I just learned that Amazon is ending the Amazon Prime “Invitee” program, via which I’ve had Amazon Prime for free, for many years. This program gave me some benefits of Amazon Prime, such as free shipping, but not the Prime streaming service.

So a compensatory benefit of having to pay for real full Amazon Prime is I’d get the Prime streaming. The big question is, will the Prime streaming app on my Android TV have awful Dolby Prologic audio, like the other apps from companies with incompetent programmers? Or will Prime have DD like Netflix and Plex?

Let’s assume that Prime doesn’t do DD. Every time there’s an article on Ars Techinca about smart TVs and streaming boxes doing something anti-consumer, there’s a lot of comments that say “just get an Apple TV box”.

But I don’t understand how the box works, and the Apple product page is light on details. Note that I don’t have Apple TV+, and have never bought video (or audio) media through the old or new versions of iTunes. I just want to stream from HBO Max, Paramount+, Starz, and Amazon Prime.

  • Can you use the Apple TV box without Apple TV+ or buying shows from Apple?
  • Does the Apple TV box have separate apps for these streaming services? Or are you supposed to use the Apple TV app?
  • In either case does it support streaming subscriptions that aren’t being bought through Apple? Remember, I have some of these subscriptions as a benefit from my cable provider.
  • Does it output Dolby Digital for these apps?
  • The Apple TV app page says that it can run on other devices, including Android TV. If you can use the Apple TV app to stream shows from other streaming services (like HBO Max), then could I use it to get DD out? This assumes Apple’s app doesn’t have the same audio problem as the other apps.*

I’m thinking I could connect the Apple TV box my TV. Because, if I get DD from the HDMI-connected cable box and BD player through the optical cable from my TV to the AVR, it should work for the Apple TV box too.

* My theory is that the problem apps are using a standard Android framework that doesn’t support DD through the optical connection, but Netflix is priviledged and Plex rolls their own code.

2

Yes.

It can be a mix of both. All services have their own apps, but some have a feature that lets you see those via the Apple TV app so you don’t have to switch. Others just switch to their own app whenever you choose to play content that is only available via their app.

Yes, that’s is my setup as well. I have DirecTV and get those movie channels via them. On my Apple TV device I authorize a “TV provider” (which is a one-time setup to input my DirectTV login info – I recommend using an iPhone as an Apple TV remote so you can type on the phone or use a password manager to enter the details) and then each app can get the content you are entitled to receive. It’s pretty nice and easier than in the past.

That one I don’t know as I don’t use a sound system (never bothered to hook it up after my last move).

Note there are rumors that there’s a new Apple TV box coming out very soon – it might even be announced next week at the iphone show. If you’re wanting to buy one, it might be prudent to wait and see what features the new box has (or get a discount on an old box when those prices drop).

4 Likes
3
  • Can you use the Apple TV box without Apple TV+ or buying shows from Apple?

Yes.

  • Does the Apple TV box have separate apps for these streaming services? Or are you supposed to use the Apple TV app?

Separate apps; most – but not necessarily all – of those apps you mention are available on the Apple TV box.

  • In either case does it support streaming subscriptions that aren’t being bought through Apple? Remember, I have some of these subscriptions as a benefit from my cable provider.

Not sure. May depend upon your cable provider and the apps/subscriptions involved.

  • Does it output Dolby Digital for these apps?

Don’t know, can’t check it easily on my setup.

  • The Apple TV app page says that it can run on other devices, including Android TV. If you can use the Apple TV app to stream shows from other streaming services (like HBO Max), then could I use it to get DD out? This assumes Apple’s app doesn’t have the same audio problem as the other apps.

Don’t know; we haven’t subscribed to the Apple TV app for quite a while.

Our house has an LG “WebOS” smart TV, a Smart “Roku” OS smart TV; a dumb TV, and several large-screen monitors attached to various computers. Plus an Apple TV 4k box, and a Roku Ultra box. As well as three iPads. And, yes, we have a ChannelMaster antenna on the roof which picks up about 30 broadcast TV channels (viewable on the dum & smart TVS, but not the monitors nor computers or iPads).

To make a long story short, the apps and their capabilities vary according to what they’re running on: WebOS, Roku TV or Ultra box, Apple TV box, or iPad (few of those apps are available on Macs – haven’t check to see what’s available on Windows).

Also, which other subscriptions (besides the app’s “native” subscription) are available also depends likewise.

Spectrum is our current IP provider. They also provide “cable TV” in the form of their own Spectrum app (they no longer provide a separate “cable TV” box – it’s all streaming). And subscriptions to several other common apps are provided as well. So, it’s a bundle – but requires running separate apps. In comparision, subscribing to the Disney app brings along some other subscriptions as well (some optionally) – but you have to access those through the Disney app.

We’re thinking of changing to a different IP provider soon, since the 2-year “introductory” Spectrum pricing will soon expire, raising our monthly cost for Spectrum to rise significantly. So, we’re in the process of trying to untangle what works with what; which subscriptions get bundled with what, and which apps & subscriptions provde the best resolutions and best sound, etc. But for now, we’re really confused, sigh.

1 Like
4

I have Spectrum also. The Spectrum streaming app would be useful for when the cable box channels are having trouble, but guess what? The Spectrum app is available for Android, but not Android TV. Sigh.

I’ve heard that they provide their own Xumo streaming box instead of the conventional cable box. But that you don’t get the full benefits of a DVR this way.

5

As a general rule, streaming devices do not care how you get your access to any particular streaming service. Free, paid, adjunct to another service, shared by your mother-in-law, doesn’t matter. (Okay, some services care about shared accounts. But your streaming device won’t.) If you have a valid login, then you can use it on any device with an app (or web access) for that service. This includes your iPhone, iPad, and Mac.

Your cable company should have provided you a username/password or login instructions for using those streaming services outside of the cable box. If they didn’t, you should be able to get that info in their app, on the box itself, or on their website.

1 Like
6

The Apple TV box, at least the recent 4K version, also has an underrated feature that might or might not be useful to you. Turned out to be important to me after I had cataract surgery (separated by a couple of weeks for each eye) – and my vision was so poor while I was recovering that I couldn’t clearly see what was on the screen of my iPhone and iPad.

You can “mirror” the screen of either an iPhone or iPad to an Apple TV 4K box. Display its output on a large-screen TV and you can make the text, icons, and imagery as large as you want – and view them from whatever distance you like. It’s possible to – for instance – read a novel using the Books app mirrored on a large-screen TV across the room. Or browse the web using Safari with really large print.

Apple Play can be used to mirror an iPhone or iPad display onto a WebOS or Roku TV, but the experience is not as seemless, nor is the resolution quite as good. If you’re partly visually impaired (even temporarily), I recommend screen mirroring from one Apple device to another – and using as big a TV or monitor as needed.

3 Likes
7

Don’t take this as scripture, but I heard that the update to the TV OS that is coming has pass through audio that greatly improves the audio quality in situations like this where the Apple TV box has been compressing the audio. I am looking forward to trying it myself.

8

You can use a Mac, of course, with a large-screen TV or monitor with a simple DVI cable. But doing it wirelessly – especially from an iPhone or iPad rather than a Mac – is a different problem. Where I found having an Apple TV 4k very handy.

9

That actually could be a downside. My other theory about why I don’t get Dolby Digital from some apps is it is related to the fact that Dolby Digital Plus won’t pass through the optical connection – it maxes out at 5.1 channel DD.

HBO Max claims to support DD+. Maybe the app checks for the device’s output capabilities, and if DD+ isn’t supported, downgrades to PCM stereo.

10

In addition to using the physical remote that comes with an Apple TV box, you can also Apple’s Remote app on an iPhone, or Apple Watch. The Remote on the Apple Watch works better than I’d have thought.

11

“I’ve heard that they provide their own Xumo streaming box instead of the conventional cable box. But that you don’t get the full benefits of a DVR this way.”

The Xumo box is an extra-cost option. unnecessary IMHO, since the Spectrum app runs on whatever smart TV you have (as well as iPads & iPhones – but not Macs).

12

There is a very nice third-party remote from Function 101 (I prefer the Bluetooth model to the infrared myself), and if you have an old Logitech Harmony remote, than can control the Apple TV as well.

We dropped Spectrum TV last year, but the last I used it the Spectrum app did not support DVR, pausing live TV, rewinding, etc. Once we had the Spectrum DVR box we couldn’t use live TV without it. So now we use YouTube TV for live TV.

As for the Apple TV app, we only use it on our Apple TVs when we watch something on TV+. Otherwise we just switch between apps on the tvOS home screen.

1 Like
13

Sound is definitely something I’ve noticed is lacking with my Apple 4K TV. If I have a choice of a movie to stream or to watch on Blu-ray, the Blu-ray picture is better, but the sound is extremely improved as opposed to streaming sound. I would love to hear if there’s a good way to fix that problem. I do like my Apple TV, though both for its convenience as well as integration into the Apple subsystem.

14

The Spectrum app runs on every Smart TV except for those running Android TV (now called Google TV). No one knows why Spectrum hasn’t released an Android TV app. It can’t be that hard since they already have an app for other Android devices.

My guess is that Spectrum has a deal with Roku or Samsung to not support Android TV. “We’ll reduce the Roku license fee if you make the app exclusive”.

15

If you get an Apple TV (or any other streaming device, you should connect the streaming device (and your cable box and any other video accessory) directly to your AVR, and then connect the TV as a video monitor to the AVR. Use the streaming apps associated with the streaming box, rather than the TV. That way, the sound will be delivered at the highest quality your AVR and speaker setup allows, not limited by the optical cable. If you run out of HDMI ports on your AVR, connect those accessories that do transmit Dolby Digital via your optical cable to your TV, but leave the others connected directly to the AVR.

I’m using the generic term ‘streaming device’ because, for the apps you specified, Amazon’s Fire TV or the Google TV streamer work just as well as an Apple TV, but are cheaper. The Apple TV has more storage, allowing you to load more apps, and features a better processor, which enables quicker connections. Also, as others have pointed out, it will easily allow you to use the TV as a monitor for your other Apple devices.

One minor point, in iOS 16 (and future OS’s), the Apple TV controller app is no longer an option of the Remote app, but is found in the Control Center.

1 Like
16

Ordinarily I would say yes, but note that your receiver may have a bandwidth limit, affecting some capabilities.

On my system, I originally connected it this way (ATV to receiver via HDMI only, receiver to TV via HDMI). The receiver is 4K capable, but its HDMI output doesn’t have enough bandwidth to carry Dolby Vision HDR video at 4K. When I tried to enable DV on the ATV, the test screen wouldn’t display (black screen and an error on the receiver). So all HDR content had to be in HDR10 format.

But when I connected the Apple TV directly to the TV’s HDMI input, and used HDMI ARC to deliver audio from it to the receiver, I was able to get DolbyVision. And there was plenty of bandwidth to deliver 5.1 surround audio (I forget all the formats, but Dolby Digital was definitely one of them) back to the receiver.

2 Likes
17

I own both a Google TV stick and an AppleTV. Even though the experience is more or less the same, there are enough small quality-of-life annoyances on the Google TV that I will spend the extra $$$ for AppleTV the next time I need a video streaming box.

A quick shortcut for thinking about AppleTV is that it is an iPad that connects to your TV.

AppleTV uses apps to do stuff. You use the App Store to download apps. Apps are available from both Apple and various companies. It requires an Internet connection to work. And similar to Apple Music on iPads, while you can use the AppleTV app (note that AppleTV+ is Apple’s subscription video service, yeah that’s confusing!) to manage and purchase videos, there are plenty of other apps that do the same thing. Some of the apps only work with a single streamer and others work with many streamers.

And one other thing: if you are a cable TV subscriber, most of the apps dedicated to a single service—such as ESPN—allow you to watch streams by providing the user name and password you use to manage your cable account.

18

And some only work that way.

For instance, the History Channel’s app only shows the most recent 2-3 episodes of each show if you’re logged on as a guest. But if you log on with your live TV provider (and they seem to support all of them), you can view each show’s entire back-catalog. Sadly, there doesn’t seem to be a way to buy a subscription directly - so the only way to get full access is to subscribe to somebody’s live TV service.

2 Likes
19

Apple TV app - Apple says “The Apple TV app is everywhere” … "See it on your smart TV or streaming device. It links to How to Watch Apple TV for compatible devices. That page links to Smart TVs and streaming devices. That page gives instructions for Android TV: search for “Apple TV”. So, it should run on Android TV, right?

When I search the Google Play store, it says that Apple TV is not available for my device.

20

I have the AppleTV app on my Google streaming video stick. It’s been awhile since I installed it so I can’t remember the specific method for obtaining the app but it might not have been in the Google Play Store. Perhaps there is a separate Android TV store (the Google stick runs the Android TV OS).