Shock! G Suite legacy free is disappearing! What should I do?

paul9 · April 14, 2022, 4:00am

I have been on iCloud custom domain email for a while using Apple apps, and just tested it with Postbox (a 3rd party email app) on the Mac.

I had no problems receiving and replying to email addressed to both my icloud.com/me.com and custom domain email addresses. Even though they all came in through iCloud mail servers into a single in box, in replies, Postbox used the correct FROM address according to the TO address the original replied-to email was sent to.

When I installed Postbox, I gave it my iCloud email info and followed their directions for setting up the required app-specific password. Once email was working, I entered my custom domain email “Identity” in Postbox preferences. That worked. One difference from Apple Mail is you don’t get the rapid push email from iCloud–Postbox has to poll the IMAP service. (Also I prefer table-style list layout, which I don’t see in Postbox)

While Apple can’t vouch for 3rd party app behavior, and neither can I, I can’t see a big problem, at least with this app.

doug2 · April 14, 2022, 4:34am

Thanks for the test. I guess Apple’s wording/caution comes down to “we didn’t test it on other apps and so can’t support it” rather than a blanket “it won’t work.”

trilo · April 14, 2022, 8:35am

I never had an issue when using Postbox with iCloud mail. Yes, it was a little more involved because it required the app specific password but that was a one-off inconvenience.

My memory can’t recall why I stopped using it but there was something that bugged me and I ended up back with Apple Mail. I’m not running a custom domain but I have a few I’m not using so may set one up just to see how it works.

I don’t see using a 3rd party app as an issue (other than the app password).

ace · April 14, 2022, 2:18pm

Really not blackmail: the action, treated as a criminal offense, of demanding payment or another benefit from someone in return for not revealing compromising or damaging information about them

Arguably bait-and-switch, though intent would have be proven for more than informal usage: the action (generally illegal) of advertising goods which are an apparent bargain, with the intention of substituting inferior or more expensive goods

jbr · April 14, 2022, 5:15pm

In England, blackmail is defined, and its penalty prescribed, by s21 of the Theft Act 1968:

21 Blackmail

(1) A person is guilty of blackmail if, with a view to gain for himself or another or with intent to cause loss to another, he makes any unwarranted demand with menaces; and for this purpose a demand with menaces is unwarranted unless the person making it does so in the belief—

(a) that he has reasonable grounds for making the demand; and

(b) that the use of the menaces is a proper means of reinforcing the demand.

(2) The nature of the act or omission demanded is immaterial, and it is also immaterial whether the menaces relate to action to be taken by the person making the demand.

(3) A person guilty of blackmail shall on conviction on indictment be liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding fourteen years.

In the US, as far as I can tell, it’s even more restricted:

18 US Code §873 – Blackmail

Whoever, under a threat of informing, or as a consideration for not informing, against any violation of any law of the United States, demands or receives any money or other valuable thing, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one year, or both.

It’s at best unwise and at worst phenomenally foolish to levy unwarranted accusations of criminal conduct. A company which says “you can’t use our services unless you pay for them” is guilty of commerce; at worst, perhaps, if it has previously warranted that they may be used for free, a breach of contract.

Words have meanings and the language is not enriched by using them incorrectly.

doug2 · April 14, 2022, 5:43pm

I accuse them of bad faith, abuse of trust, and dishonorable actions. And I don’t take back those words.

jbr · April 14, 2022, 6:01pm

I’m sure they’re deeply wounded; but none of those is a criminal offence.

ace · April 14, 2022, 6:43pm

Alright, I’m culpable too, but let’s wind down the discussion of the wording. We’re speaking informally here, and let’s not exaggerate unnecessarily.

nello · April 14, 2022, 6:55pm

Yes, this was ALWAYS the bargain with Google. They are in the targeted advertising business and users want Internet services. A deal was willingly struck between them.

As I understand, Google does not sell your information per se. I think that they mine your information and assemble lists based on the demographic/psychographic/etc. attributes that they find. No doubt others on this list can correct me and fill in the details.

But, is there complete privacy at any ISP?

Don’t almost all ISPs have the ability to snoop on you; don’t almost all of them store your data, e.g., email, contacts, calendar, etc., in plain text on their server or have the keys to unlock any encrypted files stored on their server? The only exception I can think of is ProtonMail.

Perhaps some of Apple’s services are also exceptions. For example, I understand that they do NOT have the keys for some end-to-end encrypted communication services such as Messages sent between iPhones. But we know, that Apple has the key(s) to much of the encrypted user data stored on iCloud servers; that’s how iCloud Data Recovery Service can recover your data if you forget the password to your AppleID.

MMTalker · April 14, 2022, 8:33pm

In addition to knowing what you search, a big part of Google’s advertising and custom research services involves location tracking. It’s a big reason why developed Google Maps. But Maps is not the only way they can determine your whereabouts. If you’ve got your phone on and are using an Android device, they know where you are, and if you’ve done or are doing a search for a destination.

Geofencing is a MEGA revenue producer for Google. It’s very popular with restaurants, retailers of all shapes and sizes, entertainment and travel destinations and services. It’s also been embraced by ambulance chasing lawyers. Here’s the scoop from Google:

“Geofencing combines awareness of the user’s current location with awareness of the user’s proximity to locations that may be of interest. To mark a location of interest, you specify its latitude and longitude. To adjust the proximity for the location, you add a radius. The latitude, longitude, and radius define a geofence, creating a circular area, or fence, around the location of interest.

You can have multiple active geofences, with a limit of 100 per app, per device user. For each geofence, you can ask Location Services to send you entrance and exit events, or you can specify a duration within the geofence area to wait, or dwell, before triggering an event. You can limit the duration of any geofence by specifying an expiration duration in milliseconds. After the geofence expires, Location Services automatically removes it.”

And there are plenty of third party services working with Google/Android geolocation, here are just a few:

But there are so many good and important uses for geotracking, including emergencies of all sizes and shapes. And Apple and Google might not be able to handle mapping effectively. There’s a good summary about Apple’s mapping and location services here:

nello · April 14, 2022, 9:07pm

This Apple support article seems to indicate that you can use any email client (on either Windows or macOS) to access iCloud Mail, but in some circumstances, you’ll have to create and use an “app-specific password.”

These circumstances include:

Manually setting up mail with your iCloud account in Windows;
Using Mac OS X Mail (10.7.4 and earlier); or
Using any other third-party mail client.

I can’t find any reason to believe that using using a custom email domain with iCloud mail requires the use of Mail.app.

UPDATE April 14, 2022 9:51 PM
I got absolutely nowhere asking about this in Apple’s Support Community, as you can read for yourself here.

doug2 · April 14, 2022, 9:19pm

Thanks.

Anyway, just to get back to basics, while I might (unless I can convince a couple of team members otherwise) need to continue Gmail for my teeny tiny company with a paid account, I do want to move my private email away.

It seems maybe my best choice might just be standard IMAP in my cPanel at the hosting service I already have, and where I host other domains. I’m checking with them on the best way to import everything from Gmail now.

As far as labeling goes, that will mean giving up multi-labels, which I do like. But there are no multi-label apps for iOS anyway, and I guess I can simplify my life by sticking with single labels/folders and continuing to use MsgFiler on my Mac (which works great) and Outlook on my iPhone, which has a nice filing feature that Apple Mail, for some reason, won’t add to their iOS app.

Another nice thing about the regular IMAP in my existing service, of course, is that I don’t have to worry about how many accounts I have.

One followup about what Google will supposedly continue to provide to legacy users. They specifically mention that they will no longer free legacy users to pay in order to keep their YouTube accounts. And Google Play purchases. But they don’t mention Google Photos. Anybody know about that?

nello · April 14, 2022, 9:22pm

What about Gmail for iOS?

nello · April 14, 2022, 9:47pm

You can contact Google support from within your existing G Suite admin screen:

Click on the question-mark-in-a-circle at the top of the window
Click on the “Contact support” button of the bot’s windoid
Click “I need more details on this change”
Click “I need more help”
Describe your problem in just a few words and press return
Click “This didn’t help, continue to support”
Select either “Chat” or “Web”
Click “Continue”

If you chose “Web” you’ll get a form to fill out and when you click on “Submit” it will open a formal Google Workspace support case for you. (I never chose “Chat” so I don’t know what it does.)

When I did this to learn about support for legacy Google Voice, I received an email reply in four days. Reply to the email to ask additional questions. The case stays open until you stop replying.

Please post what you find out.

doug2 · April 14, 2022, 9:51pm

Gmail for iOS, surprisingly enough, is the worst iOS app there is for filing and archiving if you have any sort of complicated label structure, or nested labels. Unlike the web interface, there are no key shortcuts. You actually have to scroll to locate each label.

At least with Outlook in iOS there is a label search bar and you can start typing and it will find your labels for easy filing. No idea why Apple Mail doesn’t add that simple, convenient feature. It’s not multi-labeling, but at least it makes filing in iOS easy.

Gmail in iOS does not make filing easy at all.

ErikMH · April 14, 2022, 9:57pm

I’ve been a FastMail customer for nearly twenty years, and can highly recommend them.

And they have a toggle whereby folders become labels. This works just like in Gmail if you’re using their web interface or their iOS/iPadOS apps — but it also works reasonably well with most other IMAP clients:

doug2 · April 14, 2022, 10:07pm

It didn’t work quite in the order you specified - perhaps our time zones or locations are different - but I was able to do a chat right away.

They are supposedly sending me a transcript of the chat, but it hasn’t arrived yet. When it does I’ll add more detail.

But yes, Google Photos will be one of the services we can retain from our legacy account.

And we can use our custom domain as a “check other email accounts” alias in our regular @gmail.com account, I guess, as we have been able to do until now.

What they don’t know yet is if exported email from the current account can be imported into the regular @gmail.com account.

doug2 · April 14, 2022, 10:14pm

Here is the chat transcript:

Subject: I need more details on the change for legacy users
Chat transcript:

Rigoberto: Hi Doug, thank you for patiently waiting. I hope you are doing fine today. Google Workspace Support, Rigoberto: How can I help you?

Doug Lerner: Hello. I am interested in keeping my free account. I’m disappointed that we will no longer be able to use our custom domains, but I have a separate question.

Doug Lerner: Currently it says we will be able to retain use of certain services, such as YouTube accounts. Doug Lerner: But it doesn’t mention Google Photos. Will I be able to keep my Google Photos account in my custom domain?

Google Workspace Support, Rigoberto: Yes, Doug. As Google Photos is considered a Google Workspace additional service as YouTube, you will be able to keep that service.

Doug Lerner: OK. Thank you. Do you happen to know yet how mail will work without the custom domain? Will you just migrate it all over to an @[gmail.com] account I have?

Google Workspace Support, Rigoberto: Yes, you can export the data you have in your Gmail account for your custom domain and you can also keep using your regular @[gmail.com]account.

Doug Lerner: Will there be a way to then import the data from my Gmail account with my custom domain into my regular @[gmail.com] account?

Google Workspace Support, Rigoberto: There’s not a process for that yet. But what you can do is to add your custom domain Gmail account as a “Check mail from other accounts” in your regular @[gmail.com] account, and that way the emails will be transferred, Doug.

Google Workspace Support, Rigoberto: In this Help Center Article you can check all the information about that feature Check emails from other accounts - Computer - Gmail Help

Doug Lerner: OK. Thank you for your help.

doug2 · April 15, 2022, 3:49am

Another interesting Google Workspace support chat you might find interesting. The conclusion makes me think that just migrating to a vanilla IMAP in my cPanel might be the only realistic choice.

Doug Lerner: My custom domain address in my legacy account is doug@mydomain.com. I also happen to have the Gmail account douglerner@gmail.com.

Doug Lerner: I read the page on moving email and there was a caution that only messages, but not folders/labels are moved.

Doug Lerner: Is that also true between Gmail accounts? If I move all my doug@mydomain.com mail to douglerner@gmail.com then all the folders/labels will be lost?

Google Workspace Support, Nilantar: I understand your concern.

Google Workspace Support, Nilantar: Actually we don’t have any tools to migrate your data from Google workspace to personal Gmail.

doug2 · April 15, 2022, 4:27am

I had a fascinating support chat with Google just now and wanted to share some interesting info.

The support person suggested a Google Meet screen share to help me with my technical issue (migrating all my late mother’s email and deleting her account).

He said that 90% of the chat requests they are getting these days are legacy users really upset about what is happening.

He frankly suggested that since I have a Microsoft 365 subscription anyway that the easiest thing would be to switch the accounts to that. I will check out that option and see if it is viable for two users (me and my sister).

The other interesting tidbit is that he says Google is on the verge of letting legacy users continue with their custom domain for free if they only have one email account in the workspace. I will have two, so that may not be an option for me, but it certainly is interesting to hear. And to hear about how many complaints they are getting!

He seemed friendly and was happy I was not yelling at him.