I think this is what Marco Arment recommends for nerds. Eero for everyone else.
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Sorry, but this is getting a bit beyond me. However, I think its a bit beyond you too. You say the VLANs are created by your pfSense firewall router but it seems to me that the VLANs are created by the apple access points. pfSense may honor them, but its not creating them. If it was creating them, it would be you setting the VLAN id by configuring pfSense. Its not even clear to me if your pfSense box is doing Wifi at all.
Perhaps these articles will help.
The big picture, of course, is that Apple has no interest in having their hardware play nice with anyone else.
Thanks marc. I do apologise for creating this mess. Your second example “Use Airport Extreme guest network in bridge mode” describes exactly my own settings, which result from my reading of, and implementing at home, a Darko Krizic blog on the same issue “http://tech.krizic.net/2013/09/apple-airport-extreme-guest-mode-with.html”.
So,
Yes the VLAN is created by the pfsense router, which tags the packets 1003 and sends them (though a second router within the pfsense box) to my 192.168.2.XXX network (while my main network is 192.168.1.XXX).
My pfsense box is not doing wifi (and is not capable of doing wifi), it is in the basement, where I do not need wifi, so I have used for a short time an Aiport Extreme there to do the double routing creating the guest VLAN and thereafter purchased a pfsense firewall-router instead and found a better use for my Airport Extreme in the attic where my computers live. The Aiport Express is in the living room.
I am setting the VLAN by configuring pfSense (which creates the 192.168.2.xxx guest network), but I only use these VLANS (so far) wirelessly, through a guest SSID, which is created, in a roaming fashion, by each one of my two Airport wifi access points.
And,
I wonder what wifi access points could actually replace a dying airport device (the Airport Extreme of the attic or the airport Express of the living room) in this function.
Okay, so in the UK the cost of a router with WiFi is built into the ISP’s service charge. In the US, it’s common for rental of the cable modem to be a separate line item you can avoid by buying your own and returning the rental. I finally bought one when the monthly fee was going up to $8; my non-WiFi cable modem paid for itself in less than a year.
Another difference is, on average, US homes are bigger so it’s less likely that a single access point will cover all areas well. And while the process of Americanization continues around the world, we still stand out as consumers of “stuff.”
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And small businesses too. I suspect it helped keep Apple’s foot in the door with there.
And don’t forget the original Time Capsule. If I remember correctly, it was the first router/ hard drive backup combo, and it was networked too. Whatever size the memory was, it was a lot at the time, and having networked wifi and storage at a reasonable price that was practically a no brainer to set up was a great competitive advantage.
BTW, we’ve wished for years to be able to buy our own TV cable modem and not have to pay the cable company to rent it.
Marilyn
And there are plenty of home routers out there at similar price points that are just as capable and just as simple. I had my Amplifi up and running in a couple of minutes and the only reason it took that long is I had to configure it for my Fixed IP.
There are plenty of good choices out there that are better than the Airports (I know, I switched from an Airport Extreme and two expresses to the Amplifi and solved all our weird WiFi issues) and the only way forward for Apple was either drop the product or spend engineering resources on a new mesh system. I am sure they looked ar Eero and Orby and Velop and Amplify and Google and all the others and decided there wasn’t any need for Apple to be in that space anymore because all of those products work and most of them are dead simple.
It’s as @MMTalker pointed out, Apple doesn’t make Laserwriters anymore, because that problem was solved.
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The tall Extreme I ordered yesterday just shipped. Should have it tomorrow. I hope it lasts for as many years as my flat n-type has been doing.
You can do this, but I’ve always wondered how it would complicate support if there were any problems. For instance, here’s a list of modems sold by Best Buy.
I owned my own cable modem when I was with Comcast. Other than having to call them to activate it, it worked better than the junker they were leasing us and I had no problem with support. Wirecutter has a good guide to them.
My worry isn’t if the Apple hardware will last, but how long the Airport Utility software will continue to work. Now that Apple has officially discontinued the line, will they support the software much longer? Is it 64-bit? Will it run as the OS is upgraded over the next few years? What about security issues?
Without the software, the hardware may not be configurable or updatable.
My Extreme just arrived via FedEx. Plugged it in and it did a firmware upgrade. It wanted to extend my existing network so I let it configure itself that way, renamed the unit and thought about setting it up in another room as an extender. I decided against that for now and will store it as a spare although I may revisit its use as an extender.
I’ve tried other brands such as Netgear and Asus but never had the good experience I’ve had with Airport. I’ve been a Mac user in one form or another since 1986 so I suppose there is some brand loyalty showing.
Same here. In fact, despite their instructions (and those included with the modem) I didn’t even have to call them. It worked right out of the box. I paid $80 for it, while Comcast wanted $10/month to rent theirs. LOL.
That’s exactly my experience. As long as I can get my hands on a decent Airport setup, I’m not getting anything else. There’s few things I enjoy less than having to troubleshoot wifi issues. Wireless issues in general (not just 802.11) are usually quite painful. I imagine if I were on the whole IOT bandwagon it would be a lot worse. For now, I’m not getting near that.
That’s an excellent point. My hope is that Apple will provide at least security updates for another few years. Until then 802.11 will have hopefully have advanced to a point where you might want something better than 802.11ac anyway. That said, as long as it works to do the job it’s intended to I’ll be happy.
With our cable provider you can buy a box, but you have to rent a card from them to use it with. The fee for the card is barely less than a box rental, and the boxes you can buy are not HDMI compatible.
Marilyn
Never had any issues myself, but have heard of others dealing with Comcast tech support on an outage that they were quick to blame the personal modem. I’ve always had good luck with those sent out on trouble calls vs. phone support techs.
-Al-
Be cautious with that. WiFi extended networks operate at a reduced speed so best to wire any extenders to the main access point.
-Al-
Being one of those Apple users that believed in Steve Jobs and his “It just works” and STILL DO I find myself a little unhappy with Apple’s decision to end the Airport products. For me, Airport Extremes are easy to set up and despite the slow updates for security offered just what I need for a “connected home.”
What I don’t get is that in all of the articles out since Apples announcement, no one, at least those I’ve found address the inherent lack of security in ALL consumer grade routers. Except, David Horowitz. Everything he proposes in his paper on router security makes since to me, though it is several years old now. Again I’m just a “user” I understand the mechanics of how all this works, beyond that, nope.
So, for now, I’ve purchased another AirPort Extreme as Apple states they will provide support for the next five years. I realize a lot of you guys and gals understand this “stuff” inside and out and I appreciate reading articles like this and checking out the comments. I’d love to hear or read what John Siracusa would say about this but again this is why I have you guys.
So 2 cents from a 60 y/o Apple Fan Boy, that and 25 cents will get you… 
This is because not ALL consumer-grade routers have poor security.
Routers have gotten a lot better about security. Good ones do not ship with “admin/admin” login and password, do not enable uPNP on the WAN, and do not run Internet-facing ftp/http servers. There are many good choices (most of them have been mentioned in this thread). When I installed my AMPLIFI the first thing I did was check Shield’s Up:
After I set it up for my needs I was less secure, but in ways that I was completely aware of (ports 22, 80, 443, are open, as I intend).
Excellent point on whether Apple will keep AirPort Utility going and up-to-date. Given Apple’ performance in keeping any app software other than IOS current, it does not augur well for AirPort Utility.
The documentation for AirPort Extreme, AirPort Express and Time Capsule has always been a bit light on given how convoluted Apple has organised its network services.