Is it time to move from 1Password to Apple Passwords?

TidBITS Talk
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I agree that local storage has many advantages over cloud storage, especially for sensitive and irreplaceable information. I also keep as much critical data as possible on hardware I own and control.

However, I have professional and family-support situations that require the use of cloud-based services. In these cases, a layered security approach is necessary. Encryption, passkeys, two-factor authentication, and the like all help to mitigate the risks of cloud storage.

There are workarounds in macOS, although none are as convenient and integrated as 1Password. Notes has only-store-locally and lock settings. Keychain can store “Secure Notes”. Keychain also allows keychains separate from a user’s primary keychain to be created (I don’t know if Tahoe supports either of these, though).

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I live in hope that Apple’s wallet app will mature into such a storage utility and appear in macOS too.

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43

You can enter them in Safari.

Secure, synced across devices, plus you get auto-fill for free, and the ability to view them at any time.

You can set it up on macOS or iOS.

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1Password is really not just a Password vault but a life records database. Apple Passwords doesn’t have the same user interface and features to store all the details of credit cards including their images, software and hardware serial numbers and info, lock combinations, Passport/SS card/drivers license and images. All bank account details and more. You can put all your stuff there and you only need make available to your executor the 1Password password, your Mac password and your Apple ID password and they have everything they need.

Operating the interface got messed up when they went to the new software development platform for Windows compatibility but the other big annoyance is they removed the ability to get a hardcopy of your entire vault. You can only print one record at a time. It doesn’t make a lot of logical sense, but if you keep a copy of 1Password 7, say on an older machine, you can print entire vaults to store safely. Then you only need make available to your executor that paper copy, which can be in a safe deposit box.

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45

A secure cloud is only useful if you can access it. A few years ago my 2017 iMac decided it no longer wanted to connect with iCloud. I wasted many hours doing useless things at the request of Apple support, who had no clue how to deal with the problem. One tech even admitted “iCloud has gotten very complex.” Eventually they just gave up and left me out to dry. I replaced the iMac, which I would have done anyway given its age. I never trust important data to iCloud unless I know it is available and updatable elsewhere.

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46

I don’t choose to wait for Apple to develop something if I need the functionality and alternatives are available. Remember, this is the company that took 13 years (or however many) to develop a calculator app for the iPad. They didn’t say “we didn’t think this is important,” they said “we wanted to do it right.”

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I still use 1Password v. 7. I do not want any of my secure passwords/software licenses or notes on anybody’s server. It is on my computer and stays with me, also why would I pay a subscriber fee to have the ability to use my passwords. One of the major ripoffs of the internet companies now. Also, yes Apple could change their policies at any time, I steer clear from them with password retention. I also would not want my passwords spread across multiple devices where the chances of having them being compromised increases.

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48

I am still using 1Password v6 on my Mac Studio running Sequoia. 1Password v6 still reliably syncs with my iPhone and iPad without any cloud services.

However, I am slowly transitioning to Apple’s Password app by adding passwords to the app when I am visiting that site.

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49

Having read all 48 (so far) posts to this question, only one seemed to hint at the burning question I have: succession.

1Password offers easy portability and a killer feature: an “emergency kit” and recovery codes to restore access when it is lost.

I know, the most security-minded among us will recoil at the thought that anything to do with account access is ever on paper. I get it.

But from the viewpoint of, say, estate management, my spouse and I share a 1PW family account. We’re starting to enter the demographic where it’s likely one of us won’t be around some day to maintain access to 1PW. There are at least 2 ways for the surviving spouse to unlock a disabled or deceased spouse’s account with 1PW.

How likely is it that Apple will make the same task a reasonable one for estate administrators or executors? Their protection of any details having to do with an Apple ID or an iCloud account is, to say the least, relentless.

Most of the time, that’s what I want. But to put it bluntly, when I’m dead, I don’t want essential details about my Apple devices, my bank accounts, my Apple accounts, and all my software licenses so inaccessible that my spouse has to take Apple to court or wait a long, long time to be granted limited access.

1Password gives me a piece of paper that can be locked up in a fire-resistant safe, with a PDF in my spouse’s 1PW account. (I don’t even have to put it there physically, as it can be moved into her account directly through 1PW.)

Apple Passwords gives me an electrified fence around all those details, and won’t de-energize it without a fight.

I know which one I prefer.

(Parenthetically, my advice to my spouse is to grab my Apple ID if I go first and do all the transferring and device wiping and archiving she pleases without informing Apple I’ve shuffled off this mortal coil.)

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50

This is an excellent point.

I have a very detailed “In Case Something Happens To Us” document shared with my wife and my kids that details exactly how to get into my accounts, access my passwords - when I switched briefly to Apple Passwords, I had instructions for that, too, though now I am back to 1Password - and do exactly what you suggest - take care of everything in my Apple iCloud details before closing my account.

We do have an iCloud family plan (one child left it for some reason :man_shrugging:) and I do still have some Apple Passwords, for things like Netflix accounts, online bank/credit card accounts, insurance accounts, etc., in Apple Passwords shared to the family group, so my wife and now one of my kids can see/use them. I also have detailed things to do in case something happens to me to maintain and transfer the Verizon plan we all use, etc.

But Apple Passwords does have that - the ability to add passwords to shared groups. We all have iPhones and other Apple devices, so this works for our family. If for some reason my family wasn’t able to access any of my devices to see my passwords, anything that they really need are in the shared group, and losing access to the online account on my favorite running shoe’s web site is probably not a critical loss.

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51

I recently helped multiple family members with estate stuff. I agree that the actions above are a good thing to do. I’ll also add that postponing or resisting making preparations can create a huge mess. Big life events have a way of happening all of a sudden.

For anybody interested, here is an earlier thread about how Apple can make it difficult to gain access to Apple accounts:

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52

Back when we used the Keychain Access application to manage our secrets, you could store Secure Note items. These are really useful for sensitive information (e.g., family members’ SSNs or made-up answers to so-called “security questions”). But Apple failed to bring that feature forward to the Passwords applications. And then the prevented Keychain Access from being able to create new Secure Note items. Bad Apple!

Yes, you could create locked Notes, but I don’t want to clutter up my Notes with security-relevant material that I will only access once in a blue moon. For me, that’s the one HUGE failure of Apple’s Passwords applications. And it would be so easy for them to remedy that.

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53

The problem I have with mixing Apple Passwords. (AP) with 1p is that AP’s sit on top of 1P’s window even when I don’t have something saved in AP making it sometimes hard to get to IP’s window to click on fill.

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54

I did this a couple years ago. Got off of 1Password. I use 3 systems because of various needs. I keep them all synced. First I use Apple Passwords. I can’t think of a better system than this. It’s on all my Apple devices and is basically automatic in terms of password management. But Apple Password does not work well on browsers other than Safari. For that I use Bitwarden. That works well and works on other OS platforms as well but not sure how well? I’m down to just the Mac platform these days. Lastly I am a long time user of Web Confidential. It’s not fancy. You get a set number of categories of passwords and can’t customize them. I make sure every new password I create and every password I change gets into this system. As a consultant I never count on clients knowing their passwords. So I create a separate document for each one.

The process for reconciling all my passwords was tedious and laborious but worth it. I had renovations going on at my house and had to spend 2.5 days working out of a cafe for 8 hours a day. This was my project. Glad I did it.

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55

I’ve used Password Boss for years, with never any issues, but I’ve rarely seen any mention of it in any discussions. Is anyone using it, do you have any comments? I find it to be a simple and easy password app.

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I am a long-term 1Password user/subscriber. I appreciate the insight and discussion in this thread.

Having just had my iPhone stolen, I am face to face with temporarily accessing, updating key passwords, and trying to use 2FA/Passkeys designed to keep things secure in the absence of my iOS device. FWIW, my AppleCare+ replacement will be here this morning, less than 30 hours after the device was stolen.

But I am also (at least on paper) a senior citizen and our family’s IT guru, so succession is on my mind.

Corporate longevity and focus is a topic that has not been emphasized here. I have no current concern’s about 1Password’s financial viability or stability, but my 50+ years of corporate and personal experience, especially in light of AgileBit’s anticipated IPO later this year, I worry about changing leadership, and the demands of outside and VC investors to optimize financial returns. this can lead to changing product strategies. FWIW, Apple is also subject to these influences, but is less likely to make abrupt changes in these highly user-facing “we hold of your eggs” areas.

Personally, I am confidently staying with 1Password, but am preparing a standalone digital/paper (at least for access) copy with instructions. My trust is in both Apple and in AgileBits.

Happy New Year - enjoy this next spin around the sun!

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57

I am transitioning now. Doing a clean install on one of my computers was the final push. I miss custom fields and storing other secure info. I think I’m going to use Notes for that.

I wish 1Password exported more, so will have to do that manually for notes and other registration information. If only. Apple still had a basic db application.

I’ve spent years sharing passwords with my wife and getting her to use 1Password which she had done. Now have to go through the pains of transitioning with her.

The timing of this was good as in the midst of transitioning and I learned a few things..

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Check out the apps from Proton AG, including Proton Pass. I switched from 1Password to Proton Pass several years ago and have been thoroughly impressed. It may meet your needs as well. Of course, apps are only as good as the people behind them, and you can read about that here. I don’t think you’ll be disappointed.

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Proton Pass’s pricing is almost identical to 1Password, and at a high level the features look the same. So was there a practical benefit to switching?

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Based on the many other replies, I seem to be alone in this but: I have the 1Password family plan and find it very useful to share passwords in different vaults with members of my immediate family. We each have our own passwords, driver licenses, insurance cards, and other data in there, and can keep them private or share them as needed.

This feature justifies (for us) 1Password’s switch to cloud-based storage, though I understand why some people don’t want to be forced to use it. And while I resent monthly sw subscriptions in general, I use 1Password so many times each day that I got over it very quickly.

(My other favorite feature is using it as a tool for succession planning. It is particularly easy with 1Password and they nudge you to print out the emergency kit page when you first get started. But others have discussed that already.)

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