But I do. I also understand that what is in it for Apple is that GS will be paying them for obtaining customers. The merchant fee can’t be zero, as it has to pay a proportion to Mastercard and also support all the other stuff that goes with using a credit card.
You may consider this just another anecdote, but my sister spent the years 1969 - 2015 in Scotland, except for one eighteen-month period back in the US. She was (and is) a US citizen, though she also got UK citizenship before she left. (If worst came to worst, she wanted to be able to get NHS coverage.) She was never able to get any US bank credit card, which made it difficult for her, since Scottish shops didn’t offer her shoe size, and Zappo’s and the like wouldn’t take foreign billing addresses or credit cards. When she retired a few years back, she moved to Maine, and the local bank that offered her a mortgage included a credit card in the package.
While I certainly don’t know if there are any US card issuers that will offer cards to US citizens whose primary residence is abroad, I suspect (no hating intended) your choices are to like what GS has done or to like it a lot.
You apparently have to reside physically in these United States to qualify; even if you are an U.S. citizen, it seems Goldman Sachs will not approve you if you are currently residing physically outside these United States.
Probably only government employees and military on official assignment outside these United States, can qualify.
How do they know is my question?
Using the Tor Network and the Proton Browser in conjunction with a good VPN should prevent them knowing from where the application is originating (although I haven’t tested it). But in theory, it should look like the application is coming from the U.S. and the Geolocation will be the U.S.
There are entrepreneurs who pay to join all the different VPNs and build a database of all their U.S. based servers based upon IP address. They sell this list of IP’s to anyone who wants to pay. So just a VPN alone won’t hid your location enough.
I’m more inclined to think they in addition to the IP check they are also buying data on the stream of card use based upon social Security Number. Even if they aren’t buying the name of the merchant where the car was used or the amount, they are probably only interested in swiped transaction, which pinpoints the applicants location every time they use one of their cards. Yet the card number and cardholders name or other details are never revealed. All GS wants is the geocode location of swiped transactions.
Another guess is when the applicant comes back to the U.S. and starts using their existing cards, GS will know that too based on the data they’re buying and the application might get approved. Who knows how long the applicant would need to use the card in the U.S. before applying (again). I guess the refresh rate of the data is what would determine how long it would it would take to establish a physical presence in the U.S.
I also wound’t be surprised to learn that owning real property in the United States would be a huge positive. Even if the property were rented out to someone else. Property can be attached via lein in the event of a default.
Once the card is issued, it can be used anywhere MasterCard is accepted worldwide. I doubt as long as the bills are paid on-time they will revoke the card once issued.
A bigger question is why? I can accept that it is much harder to sue someone for non-payment if they aren’t living full time in the United States. But there are things any issuer could do to make sure they have no financial risk whatsoever. Like a pre-paid card or attaching a co-signer. Or even a higher credit score, lower credit limit, or stricter criteria (any negative in the prior seven years is enough to cause rejection)
Because the market of ex-pats around the world exceeds 16 million people. That’s a lot of revenue to kiss off. I am still waiting to find a single person who is an ex-pat and has been approved for an Apple Card.
Compare the GS attitude to MasterCard, Visa, or American Express, which markets and operates extensively all over the world.
You actually do not need a Social Security number to get some US credit cards. There are a of authorized US residents that don’t have Social security numbers, and the card companies and merchants benefit from them:
Every bit of data the credit card companies collect is salable to advertisers; what someone does not do or buy is just as important as what someone does. Just one example would be knowing what restaurants someone walks or drives by regularly; the restaurants they do not visit would also be prospects.
According to US Law, if you get rejected for credit, you have a right to know the reason for your rejection and to get a free credit report from the credit reporting agencies.
I don’t believe this applies directly to credit cards, but since you are asking for credit to buy an iPhone, it should be covered too.
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Yes, they use TransUnion, not exactly the best Credit Reporting Agency. And yes, I do have a negative item on my report. Long story, I had a car lease with a perfect payment record, and a few weeks before lease end in 2017, my car was badly damaged by a hit & run truck backing up without looking and taking out two doors. And I was way over mileage.
I returned the car to the dealer. I worked for years in the car business and know just how highly inflated body work is. The consumer will get charged $700 to repair a door, when the internal cost if you traded that car in was maybe $200.
I figured Ford could fix the car for a lot less than I could. Well, while their out-of-pocket may have been $2,000, they sent me a bill for $8,000. The car was drivable, but I had to pay hundreds to transport the car across town to the auto auction. They never provided me with an accounting from the auction company of what the car brought at auction.
Basically, the whole charge was inflated way beyond their actual costs. So, I refused to pay, they refused to negotiate.
Great. They wrote off the debt, taking that inflated amount as a full bad debt deduction of their income taxes. Nice deal for them. Spend say $4,000 and take an $8,000 write off, the other $4,000 created out of thin air.
They sent me an IRS form because the law requires that after 6 months with no payment, the creditor must write off the debt. So, I had taxable income of $8,000 as DEBT FORGIVENESS in 2018. And I paid the taxes.
So, that should have been the end of it. 24 months of on time payments, 6 months of no payments, and an $8,000 debt charge off. Account closed.
Except Ford was reporting the account as open, with an $8,000 current balance and 3 plus years of past due payments. The account should have been reported as closed. The 3 years of past due payments for money I did not owe was maybe killing my credit. According to Experian, my current credit score is 760.
Things are complicated by the fact that before Apple started the Apple Card under Goldman Sachs, they were using Citizens One Bank to finance iPhones under their two year, no interest payment plan. I am still paying on this plan for another two months. I had no trouble qualifying for this financing at the Apple Store in April 2019.
Citizens One chooses not to report positive experiences to the credit bureaus. They only report negative and collection items. (IMHO, no creditor should be allowed to only report negatived experiences. The bureaus should forbid it. If creditors want the power of the bureaus to use as a hammer to collect debts, they should help people who pay their bills on time get proper recognition for their good payment history).
So, yes, I got an explanation from Goldman Sachs saying they relied on Trans Union. I have been fighting with Ford Credit. They will only accept challenges by U.S. Postal Mail. No phone calls, no e-mail. Snail mail.
It has taken months, but I noticed on Experian that my old car lease account is now reported as CLOSED and CHARGED OFF in 2017. No missed payments after the charge off. Might be worth another shot at getting an Apple Card without the negative data 4 years in the past.
Don’t ever use Ford Credit, though. They knew what they were doing by hitting me with a constant stream of 30, 60, 90, 180 days past due and were going to continue doing it until I caught them and challenged their submitting false data.