Upgrading to a new phone

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Upgrading to a new phone

Ray Kloss
So, I have decided to hold off upgrading my iTunes for a little while (I wish there was more than a "Remind me tomorrow" in the menu). Mainly because I plan to get a new phone this week. From what I can understand, when I get the new phone, they put the SIM card in it and default apps will be there. Then am I able to bring back the apps from my old phone? I understand the new iTunes does not back up the Apps, but does it back up the data at all? If I have an app in a certain "state" will it recover that state, or does that only apply to games in the Game Center (or nothing).

Do they really expect I will remember all the apps I have on my phone? An update I can prepare for, but what if I lose it or it is stolen or broken? That must happen more than occasionally to some people. I must be missing something that this may not work anymore. I can't back up to iCloud, I won't have enough room.

Am I missing something about the new backup to iTunes? Will it remember my apps somehow?


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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Ray Kloss
> On Sep 18, 2017, at 11:28 PM, Ray Kloss <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> So, I have decided to hold off upgrading my iTunes for a little while (I wish there was more than a "Remind me tomorrow" in the menu). Mainly because I plan to get a new phone this week. From what I can understand, when I get the new phone, they put the SIM card in it and default apps will be there. Then am I able to bring back the apps from my old phone? I understand the new iTunes does not back up the Apps, but does it back up the data at all? If I have an app in a certain "state" will it recover that state, or does that only apply to games in the Game Center (or nothing).
>
> Do they really expect I will remember all the apps I have on my phone? An update I can prepare for, but what if I lose it or it is stolen or broken? That must happen more than occasionally to some people. I must be missing something that this may not work anymore. I can't back up to iCloud, I won't have enough room.
>
> Am I missing something about the new backup to iTunes? Will it remember my apps somehow?

So from what I gathered after my second reading of Tidbits, if I upgrade to iOS 11, I may be able save data from an app. So I assume this goes into the backup somewhere. Can I use my old iTunes with a phone that has iOS 11?


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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Al Varnell
On Sep 18, 2017, at 9:51 PM, Ray Kloss wrote:
>> On Sep 18, 2017, at 11:28 PM, Ray Kloss wrote:
>>
>> So, I have decided to hold off upgrading my iTunes for a little while (I wish there was more than a "Remind me tomorrow" in the menu). Mainly because I plan to get a new phone this week. From what I can understand, when I get the new phone, they put the SIM card in it and default apps will be there. Then am I able to bring back the apps from my old phone? I understand the new iTunes does not back up the Apps, but does it back up the data at all? If I have an app in a certain "state" will it recover that state, or does that only apply to games in the Game Center (or nothing).
>>
>> Do they really expect I will remember all the apps I have on my phone? An update I can prepare for, but what if I lose it or it is stolen or broken? That must happen more than occasionally to some people. I must be missing something that this may not work anymore. I can't back up to iCloud, I won't have enough room.
>>
>> Am I missing something about the new backup to iTunes? Will it remember my apps somehow?
>
> So from what I gathered after my second reading of Tidbits, if I upgrade to iOS 11, I may be able save data from an app. So I assume this goes into the backup somewhere. Can I use my old iTunes with a phone that has iOS 11?

Have you read Apple's documentation of "Changes in the new iTunes" <https://support.apple.com/HT208075> as well as the applicable links to other documents? I think it will answer most of your questions.

-Al-
--
Al Varnell
Mountain View, CA







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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

@lbutlr
In reply to this post by Ray Kloss
On Sep 18, 2017, at 22:28, Ray Kloss <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Do they really expect I will remember all the apps I have on my phone?

Backup your phone and restore the backup to your new phone.

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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Rodney
In reply to this post by Ray Kloss

On Sep 19, 2017, at 06:28, Ray Kloss <[hidden email]> wrote:

Do they really expect I will remember all the apps I have on my phone? 

I’d guess that if you don’t remember that an app is on your phone, then you’re not using it very much.

However, there is a fairly simple solution. Open the App Store app, then tap “Updates” (bottom right on the screen). Then tap “Purchased” at the top. Select the “Not on This iPhone” tab, and you’ll see all the apps you own that aren’t on the phone. Scroll down the list and tap each app you want to install on the new phone.



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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Doug Miller
In reply to this post by Ray Kloss

On Sep 19, 2017, at 12:51 AM, Ray Kloss <[hidden email]> wrote:

So from what I gathered after my second reading of Tidbits, if I upgrade to iOS 11, I may be able save data from an app. So I assume this goes into the backup somewhere. Can I use my old iTunes with a phone that has iOS 11?

As I understand it, iTunes 12.7 is required to support syncing to iOS 11 devices. However, a full encrypted backup to iTunes (even from the last 12.6.x version) will restore all apps, data, and settings to a new phone. The apps will be re-installed from the App Store as part of the restore process, and you will not be able to restore any 32 bit apps, as they are no longer supported on iOS 11. Make sure that the iTunes backup is encrypted, or any health/activity data or account passwords will not be in the backup.

Of course, you could also backup and restore the phone from iCloud rather than iTunes.

--
Doug




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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Matt Lewkowicz
In reply to this post by Ray Kloss
Well, as someone who just upgraded to a new iPad I can say it remembers
what apps were in the last backup and, as far as I can tell, what data was
related to those applications BUT it downloads the actual apps. This bit
me as one of those with "limited" data; the upgrade inadvertently burned
through my monthly 10GB full speed data cap at home. If you have limited
data I recommend finding a fast, free or cheap, wifi network where you can
spend some time restoring the applications to the new device.

The joys of rural living where the only high speed access available is
through satellite service...
--
Matt Lewkowicz



On 9/19/17, 12:28 AM, "[hidden email] on behalf of Ray
Kloss" <[hidden email] on behalf of [hidden email]>
wrote:

>So, I have decided to hold off upgrading my iTunes for a little while (I
>wish there was more than a "Remind me tomorrow" in the menu). Mainly
>because I plan to get a new phone this week. From what I can understand,
>when I get the new phone, they put the SIM card in it and default apps
>will be there. Then am I able to bring back the apps from my old phone? I
>understand the new iTunes does not back up the Apps, but does it back up
>the data at all? If I have an app in a certain "state" will it recover
>that state, or does that only apply to games in the Game Center (or
>nothing).
>
>Do they really expect I will remember all the apps I have on my phone? An
>update I can prepare for, but what if I lose it or it is stolen or
>broken? That must happen more than occasionally to some people. I must be
>missing something that this may not work anymore. I can't back up to
>iCloud, I won't have enough room.
>
>Am I missing something about the new backup to iTunes? Will it remember
>my apps somehow?
>
>
>____________TidBITS Talk Participation Guidelines____________
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>Be polite and constructive, and comment on posts, not people.
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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

adamengst
Administrator
On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 8:26 AM Matt Lewkowicz <[hidden email]> wrote:
The joys of rural living where the only high speed access available is
through satellite service...

And unless I’m mistaken, Matt lives within 10-15 miles of me. So we’re not talking about the farthest reaches of the hinterlands or anything. It doesn’t take much in rural America to be outside the reach of broadband.

cheers... -Adam 



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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

George Wade
On 19 Sep 2017, at 10:43, Adam Engst wrote:

On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 8:26 AM Matt Lewkowicz <[hidden email]> wrote:
The joys of rural living where the only high speed access available is
through satellite service...

And unless I’m mistaken, Matt lives within 10-15 miles of me. So we’re not talking about the farthest reaches of the hinterlands or anything. It doesn’t take much in rural America to be outside the reach of broadband.

cheers... -Adam 

Where is your local Tim Hortons ?
G....



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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Mr. Seth Anderson
In reply to this post by adamengst

On Sep 19, 2017, at 9:43 AM, Adam Engst <[hidden email]> wrote:

It doesn’t take much in rural America to be outside the reach of broadband.

I live in downtown Chicago, basically, yet my condo building’s top available broadband speed is topped out at 15 MB download/1.5 MB upload. What makes it all the more galling is that I watched crews lay down brand new fiber optic cables on my street to connect to a local Google HQ, but neither Comcast nor AT&T consider my building worth the effort to connect (believe me we’ve tried, begged, cajoled to no avail). Granted our building's speed is better than the satellite only service Matt Lewkowicz mentioned, but not much. 


-Seth Anderson
sursum vestri culus




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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Matt Lewkowicz
In reply to this post by adamengst
Yes, and less than a 10 minute drive to Ithaca College. My home was purchased when internet connectivity was done through a modem and broadband was not a consumer product. In fact my original iPhone was partially purchased so I would have a reasonable connection to the internet; now it consumes my connection if I connect it to my home network…
-- 
Matt Lewkowicz

From: <[hidden email]> on behalf of Adam Engst <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: Tidbits-Talk <[hidden email]>
Date: Tuesday, September 19, 2017 at 10:43 AM
To: Tidbits-Talk <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Upgrading to a new phone

On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 8:26 AM Matt Lewkowicz <[hidden email]> wrote:
The joys of rural living where the only high speed access available is
through satellite service...

And unless I’m mistaken, Matt lives within 10-15 miles of me. So we’re not talking about the farthest reaches of the hinterlands or anything. It doesn’t take much in rural America to be outside the reach of broadband.

cheers... -Adam 



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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Ray Kloss
In reply to this post by Rodney
> I’d guess that if you don’t remember that an app is on your phone, then you’re not using it very much.
>
> However, there is a fairly simple solution. Open the App Store app, then tap “Updates” (bottom right on the screen). Then tap “Purchased” at the top. Select the “Not on This iPhone” tab, and you’ll see all the apps you own that aren’t on the phone. Scroll down the list and tap each app you want to install on the new phone.

I have some apps I use for reference that I use occasionally and like to have them available.  I also have purchased or tried-when-free so many applications that the Purchased button gives me too many options. May be a nice time to cull and find old programs I haven't used for a while.

Also, there are some programs that are not available on the App Store anymore that I still use. I will have to install them separately if they still work in iOS 11.

Not having the apps available in iTunes will be a change in my thinking, but there seem to be work arounds available.


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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Rodney

On Sep 19, 2017, at 17:34, Ray Kloss <[hidden email]> wrote:

I have some apps I use for reference that I use occasionally and like to have them available.  I also have purchased or tried-when-free so many applications that the Purchased button gives me too many options. May be a nice time to cull and find old programs I haven't used for a while.

I understand, but limiting the selection to, “Not on this iPhone” should help (at least it does for me).

I’ve also collected a bunch of free apps, etc. I figure that if I can’t remember what an app is for when initially scanning the list, but recall its use later, then I can always go back and get it. The “Not on this iPhone” list will be shorter the second time around.

Also, there are some programs that are not available on the App Store anymore that I still use. I will have to install them separately if they still work in iOS 11.

I’m not sure how that is going to work, assuming you’ve upgraded iTunes. The iTunes upgrade doesn’t delete your app folder, so all the apps you’ve downloaded are still there, but I’m not sure what you can do with them. Since I’ve started just downloading apps I deleted the folder when I upgraded iTunes.

Not having the apps available in iTunes will be a change in my thinking, but there seem to be work arounds available.

Yes. I’ve always thought of my Mac as the mother ship. I want local copies of everything “just because” if for no other reason. I still keep a local copy of all my media. For installing a new iPhone I’m glad I have fiber...




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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

David Ross
In reply to this post by @lbutlr
Not all data is backed up this way. And thus not restored.

My Tivo recordings don't get backed up to iCloud. And with the changes
in iTunes I'm not sure there is a way to back them up such that they
will re-appear in the app after a restore.

And no I really don't want to loose them. I have about 100 hours of
various interview shows like Charlie Rose that I listen to on plane
flights. I'm a bit behind just now but when you fly a round trip every
week or two it's nice to have some passive entertainment that doesn't
turn my brain to mush.

On my Round2it list.

On 9/19/17 6:37 AM, LuKreme wrote:
> On Sep 18, 2017, at 22:28, Ray Kloss <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Do they really expect I will remember all the apps I have on my phone?
> Backup your phone and restore the backup to your new phone.
>



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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

@lbutlr
In reply to this post by Ray Kloss
On 19 Sep 2017, at 09:34, Ray Kloss <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Also, there are some programs that are not available on the App Store anymore that I still use. I will have to install them separately if they still work in iOS 11.

Most apps that are no longer available in the App Store can still be restored via backup or reinstalled via the purchased tab.

It's very rare for an app to go away entirely as the developer has to explicitly make that choice. The only one I can think of is Marco Armet's Peace app.

--
Apple broke AppleScripting signatures in Mail.app, so no random signatures.




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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Zeedar Marc-2

> On Sep 19, 2017, at 6:37 PM, @lbutlr <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Most apps that are no longer available in the App Store can still be restored via backup or reinstalled via the purchased tab.

Not if they're 32-bit or haven't been updated in a long time. I've lost apps in the past that weren't restored because they're no longer available on the store, and with iOS 11, all 32-bit apps are going bye-bye.


Marc Zeedar
Publisher, xDev Magazine and xDevLibrary
www.xdevmag.com | www.xdevlibrary.com







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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

dianed143@comcast.net

> On Sep 19, 2017, at 10:37 PM, Zeedar Marc <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
>> On Sep 19, 2017, at 6:37 PM, @lbutlr <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Most apps that are no longer available in the App Store can still be restored via backup or reinstalled via the purchased tab.
>
> Not if they're 32-bit or haven't been updated in a long time. I've lost apps in the past that weren't restored because they're no longer available on the store, and with iOS 11, all 32-bit apps are going bye-bye.

Will you still be able to see that they were there? I can’t remember how it worked in the past.

Diane


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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Zeedar Marc-2

> On Sep 19, 2017, at 7:48 PM, Diane <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Will you still be able to see that they were there? I can’t remember how it worked in the past.

I wasn't able to when I upgrade to my iPhone 7 last year -- a few apps just didn't restore to the new phone. I could see them in iTunes, but it wouldn't install them since they weren't on the computer or on the Store. (And now you can't even see them in iTunes any more, if you've got the latest version.)


Marc Zeedar
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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Zeedar Marc-2
In reply to this post by Zeedar Marc-2

> On Sep 19, 2017, at 8:03 PM, gastropod <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> most things I spot checked a couple of hours ago
> are still there and downloadable (using iTune 12.66 on a mac, and iOS
> 10.n on an ipad).

Good to know!

But I assume that if you tried that with iOS 11, those wouldn't show up...

I'm waiting a few days or a week to upgrade my iPad, in part because I need to go through all my 32-bit apps and make sure I've extracted any important data. Not looking forward to that.


Marc Zeedar
Publisher, xDev Magazine and xDevLibrary
www.xdevmag.com | www.xdevlibrary.com







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Re: Upgrading to a new phone

Doug Miller
In reply to this post by Zeedar Marc-2

On Sep 19, 2017, at 11:03 PM, gastropod <[hidden email]> wrote:

To pull 32-bit completely means people would have to throw away perfectly
good hardware unless they could live with only the built-in Apple apps.

If I am reading this page right, all apps must be 64 bit by June 2018 in order to stay in the App Store. So, there may not be much time.



--
Doug




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